Hassan Rouhani, President of Iran
Air Date 9/24/2013
Charlie Rose: Mr. President, Thank you. Welcome to New York. Tell me what you hoped to accomplish in this visit to the United Nations General Assembly.
President Rouhani: In the Name of God, the Compassionate, the Merciful. My objective on this trip has been to reflect the demand and the voice of the people of Iran. The opportunity that has been given to me here to use that platform to express that voice better to the people and the officials here that have gathered in New York and I do hope that I will succeed.
Charlie Rose: You've made a speech. The President has made a speech. There was no handshake. No bilateral meeting between you and the President. You suggested you didn't have enough time to plan for it. What's necessary for you to have a bilateral meeting with the President?
President Rouhani: Well, after all, we are speaking of two countries who have had no relations for 35 years. So, it's clear that to begin talks requires some preparation work. And, whenever the prep work is completed, I believe that it's possible to have a meeting. Perhaps if we had more time here in New York, we may have been able to coordinate what was necessary for that meeting to take place. We must all admit, I believe, that the principle of the meeting of the two sides is indeed important. Perhaps more important than that is the result of such a meeting. So, we must make every effort so that first high official meeting between two countries will definitely yield positive results.
Charlie Rose: Are you looking for a grand bargain between the United States and Iran, or are you looking specifically for some action you can take so you can get relief from sanctions?
President Rouhani: In principle, we think that and believe that the sanctions are illegal and in fact inhumane because they put pressure on our people. They put special pressure on people who are sick. They impact the life of children. And, therefore, sanctions cannot be the answer. It is an incorrect path to take to begin with.
Charlie Rose: But, the Secretary of State John Kerry and the Foreign Minister of Iran Mr. Zarif will start a series of conversations. What are you prepared to allow be negotiated on the part of the government of Iran? What's on the table?
President Rouhani: You are aware that the first issue that must be discussed is the nuclear file. And the settlement of the nuclear file will certainly pave the way for further discussions on other issues. The meeting that takes place tomorrow is with the Foreign Ministers of the P5+1. And, the agenda for the talks is Iran's nuclear file and the subject of that file.
Charlie Rose: So, before there will be some grand bargain, we need to deal to the nuclear issue. Are you prepared to reduce the number of centrifuges you have at Iranian facilities in exchange for loosening the sanctions?
President Rouhani: Well, these, I would say are the details that should be examined through the discussions that take place. What matters is that Iran must be able to assert its rights, its legal rights. I am speaking of under international law. And, that the other countries must acknowledge Iran's rights under international law. And, then, on the other hand, if there are any concerns specifically in our region about our program, it is Iran's responsibility to also address those concerns. As to the modality for that, that certainly will have to be discussed during the negotiations. But, in any case, we don't want Iran to be an exception. We do not want discrimination against Iran. We want Iran to be seen just like the rest of all other countries that have nuclear programs as well as enrichment programs.
Charlie Rose: Are you prepared for these negotiations to get under way to make sure that all the concerns of the IAEA, which have been expressed, are met?
President Rouhani: You see the world has been thinking about these issues for years. And, that's precisely why all the international law that we talk about has been devised. For example, the MPT, which allows all countries to have nuclear technology without any deviation; and, the Safeguards Agreement is for the safe person's reason; the IAEA Supervisory Role is for this reason. And, therefore, any other rules and regulations that pave the way for such a supervisory role to take place is indeed designed to guarantee all the concerns that exist are addressed. And, that is precisely why Iran took every step to assure everyone by signing the MPT to be a member of the IAEA, to allow the IAEA to carry out its supervisory role, and including the installment of cameras in all our nuclear plants which are recorded by the IAEA. Therefore, our nuclear activities are completely legal and we have nothing to hide.
Charlie Rose: How are you different from the previous President? What differences do you have with the Ayatollah?
President Rouhani: To discuss the full dimensions of what you just raised, I have to say, I think we need a detailed meeting to take place between to the two of us. But, the truth be told, in this election that took place, as well as those who ran against me, we were all required to come up with a program for the people and election sort of program. And, from the beginning, I told the people that I am a person of moderation. That my programs would be moderate ones and so will my objectives. I specified that I would be object to any radicalism or any division. And, I think it is precisely for those words that people voted for me. Even in the economic field, I insisted on moderation, meaning, that I said, that as in as far as I said it is not necessary, the government, was actually pulled back, from controlling the economy, and delegate more authority to the private sector, and that should expect to receive government assistance. In the realm of foreign policy, I said that I wish to have engagement as sort constructive interaction and engagement with the world. In the cultural sphere, I said that I want those from cultural authorities in the country to decide about the cultural field. Therefore, in the plan that I drew up, I specifically tried to state what I mean by moderation. And, the people of Iran voted for this dialogue with me and I will remain committed to my pledge to the people to carry out all those programs.
Charlie Rose: It is often said in the Western press that all the power is with the Ayatollah and that you can only go so far. He is friend of yours. Both Ayatollahs have been friends of yours. He must be backing what you are doing. Otherwise, you would not be doing it.
President Rouhani: The constitution of Iran actually defines the prerogatives of the President; his responsibilities in very no uncertain terms. The prerogatives and responsibilities of Supreme Leader have also been categorized in the constitution quite clearly. We all follow this law and its the constitution that defines exactly what needs to take place and what the framework for our activities is as such. So, within that framework I tell you that I don't anticipate the President forcing any problems in carrying out his constitutional prerogatives at least in the past few months that I've started working, I have not confronted any hurdles, and I don't anticipate them.
Charlie Rose: You also know that the Revolutionary Guard has spoken out and it was considered by some in the press as firing a shot across your bow, saying don't go too far, watch out, moderation can only be going so far.
President Rouhani: The IRGC also has prerogatives that are clearly defined in the constitution. The IRGC is a force just as its name suggests. The Islamic Revolutionary Guards Core protects the revolution and protects the Islamic Revolution and the country as well. And, the IRGC constitution speaking has its own responsibilities. And, the commander of the IRGC is a member of the Supreme National Security Council where the President is also a member, where the Defense Minister is also a member, and that explains all the required coordination between these branches does takes place in one unit. Therefore, the IRGC has no intention of intervention in political affairs, which has also been stressed and declared by the Supreme Leader that the IRGC must understand politics but it must not take sides or be a member or part of any political grouping or parties.
Charlie Rose: Tell us about you in terms of this election. You did not have the support of the Ayatollah. There were other more conservative candidates. Yet, you won. What does that say about Iran and its desire for something new including a better relationship with the United States?
President Rouhani: Well, after all, we all had our plans. And, we presented them to the people. And, we all had our supporters, our group of supporters, so-to-say, and those supporters had freedom to express their support for their candidates. And, we had television debates, as you well know, during which we sort of expanded on our views. The rival candidates sat and freely talked about a host of issues that people watched and heard. And so in the end, they chose to follow the path that I present, the plan that I present. In other words, which is a plan of moderation and also plan of prudence as well as hope.
Charlie Rose: The President said he gives you respect and recognition of Iran's right to have peaceful nuclear energy. That seems to be an answer to your concern.
President Rouhani: Well, the nuclear issue has turned into an issue of national pride and a symbol of the perseverance of the people. And, I want to say that the people really have never demanded anything beyond what the law designates, nothing over and above what is rightfully theirs. And, therefore, the nuclear issue is become a symbol of development of sorts in Iran. The modern know-how required to go hand-in-hand with this technology is a symbol for the Iranian people. So, I think, hand-in-hand, we must move forward to ensure that the international law is enforced. And, once we abide by that, I think that everything else is settled.
Charlie Rose: Do you need 18,000 centrifuges in order to have sufficient peaceful use of nuclear energy?
President Rouhani: The number of centrifuges really does not matter. What matters is for us to be able to provide the fuel for the nuclear reactor. You are aware of the fact that one nuclear reactor similar to what we have in Bushehr, the Bushehr nuclear plant, needs annually needs 30 tons of enriched uranium. And, in its first load, it needs 90 tons of enriched uranium. So, these are calculations, technical calculations, that are over and beyond our patience here. But, we do not need centrifuges over and above the fuel needs that we have. And, so the number of centrifuges that are developed is dependent on the required fuel.
Charlie Rose: Let me talk about Syria. What is your interest in Syria because clearly Iran's support of Syria, and I just returned from there, has been instrumental? Iran. Russia. Hezbollah.
President Rouhani: You know that our relations with Syria go back to a long time ago. You know that during the 8 year war that we went through, one of the countries, one of the sole Arab countries, and given that Iraq that was fighting Iran and attacked Iran was also an Arab state, Syria stood out and chose to support Iran. And, therefore, our relationship goes back to the hard times, the time of war, the time of defense, as far as we were concerned, against Iraq's invasion. Also, you know that Syria also rests in a region, in a part of the world, that is extremely sensitive. The entire Middle East is very sensitive these days. We have important interest as a result. One of our key interest is the stability of the region. If the region is destabilized further, it will effect all of us and create a predicament for all of us. The entire region needs peace. The peace must prevail across the region. If there is war in one corner of the Middle East, the heat of the war, the flames of the war, will reach all of us and create problems for us. We are also deeply concerned about the strengthening of terrorism in the region. It seems that all categories of terrorist groups have gathered in Syria. So, our interest is to ensure that terrorism is not empowered. We are deeply concerned by the civil war in Syria because this country is on the brink of full destruction. Not to mention the fact that people of Syria are suffering, innocent people are being killed, people do not have easy lives. It is a pain for any human being to bear what is happening in Syria. Whatever power we have, whatever in our capacity and abilities to halt this war in Syria, in my opinion, will be important, in my humble opinion, for the rest of the world will, actually, help alleviate the suffering. If we can alleviate the suffering of the Syrian people we'll all benefit from it. So, ultimately, we'll take measures to settle the numbers in our region, and we believe that the only path is through democratization in a sense that the vote of the people of Syria, the ballot box, must prevail ultimately in defining the fate of the country.
Charlie Rose: Do you believe that Syria will dismantle all of its chemical weapons and hand them over?
President Rouhani: We, all our hope, I'll tell you, is that the entire stockpiling of chemical weapons is eradicated across the world, especially in our region. We're, indeed, very glad that Syria has permitted to the accession of CWC because we ourselves, if you recall, are victims of chemical weapons. We feel the pain that those weapons create. We've experienced it.
Charlie Rose: Then, what do you think happened on August 21st? Chemical weapons, according to the United Nations, were used in an attack on the Syrian people in a rebel controlled area and the rockets came from an area controlled by the regime.
President Rouhani: We will certainly at all times categorically denounce the use of chemical weapons no matter who uses them. But, in Syria, more work needs to be done to really be certain who did it, what equipments was used. You know that before that before chemical weapons were used in the suburbs of Damascus, in Khanul Asal these chemical weapons were also used. Previously, around that time, we had informed the US officials that terrorist groups in Syria have chemical weapon facilities in their hands. But, as to who used them, I think it's fair enough to expect more works needs to be done.
Charlie Rose: A reporter, a distinguished reporter, here just had an article in the New Yorker magazine talking about the head of the Quds Forces in Iran General Qasem Soleimani. He has made repeated trips to Damascus. He is very much involved in that war.
President Rouhani: Well I tell you that military personnel go back and forth to Syria. We have defense agreements with Syria that go way back. It is quite clear to us that military personnel and attaches should be present in our embassies on a continual basis. They have always. And, you know that military attaches are in our embassies more or else. And, more countries around the world have military exchanges. But, this does not mean, I caution you, that we have chosen to enter the Syrian war. In principle, when a war regrettably happens in a country and takes the shape of a civil war, it is not our intention to be present in that civil war, nor does it have any meaning to be present in the civil war. But, at the same time, any country, it could be that we have military attaches.
Charlie Rose: There is one issue I have to clear up because it was talked about this morning and was talked about ever this afternoon after an interview with Christiane Amanpour of CNN raised the question of the holocaust. And, the question has meaning here because of your predecessor. And, the question was asked, do you accept the fact that there was a holocaust in which more than 6 million Jews were killed? And, can you separate a recognition of that, not leave it to historians, but accept a recognition of that, and not let it be clouded by whatever feelings you have about the establishment of the State of Israel in the Middle East?
President Rouhani: In principle, we condemn the massacre carried out by the Nazis in the World War 2. I'll also add that many groups were killed by the Nazis in the course of the war, Jews in specific, but there were also Christians, there were Muslims. And, so, in principle, I'll tell you that my government, I condemn massacre, killing of people. I'll tell you that when an innocent person is killed, we never go about asking or enquiring whether they were Jewish, or Christian, or Muslim. That is not our way, our creed. We simply say we condemn any killing, any massacre. And, therefore, we condemn the massacre of the Jewish people by the Nazis. We also condemn the other massacres that took place in the course of the war.
Charlie Rose: You do not want to deny that it took place because that is an insult to humanity.
President Rouhani: Why would I want to deny it? Why would I want to deny it? I want to add to this debate. Not only do I deny the criminal acts of the Nazis, we condemn it. At the same time, I really believe, because given that we live in the Middle East. We feel the impact of what took place in World War 2 today in our region. We think that it's time to really separate that from what is happening to a group of people now in the Middle East who lost their homes, who've been discriminated against, who have gone through some of the worst kinds of torture that no one of even the Jewish people would want to see. We are opposed to Nazis. We are opposed to any sort of pseudo-Nazism that should take place in the world today, by whomever in our world today.
Charlie Rose: Are you fully supportive of Secretary Kerry's efforts to bring about an agreement between the Palestinians and the Israelis? Fully supportive?
President Rouhani: So far, we don't see any signs of peace, to be honest with you. The issue of Palestine, we think, has to be decided by the Palestinians, has to be decided by the people who live there, whatever they choose for themselves. We don't own Palestine, as you know, but we do support their, you know, their pride, their cause.
Charlie Rose: You understand friendship. I have a friend by the name of John Miller who is a colleague in journalism. He's a close friend of the family of Robert Levinson. You've heard this before. I owe it to him to ask, do you know of his whereabouts as he may have gotten caught up in the judicial system of Iran? And, whether he can be exchanged for someone else, or whether there is a possibility, because the family suffers not knowing where their father and their husband is? Could you help the Levinson family have that possibility?
President Rouhani: I wish, I wish I could help a family in suffering. But, I really tell you that we have not, we do not know any information, have any information about this person. Actually, there are intelligence services have said that he is not in Iran. As to where his whereabouts when he disappeared, I personally have no information on those details. But, naturally, when someone disappears, their family suffering, everyone must help, it's natural, that everyone must help. Thank you.
Charlie Rose: I finally end with this. Thank you for doing this. And, I think that you obviously know that this has been an important mission by you, the possibility of two great countries understanding each other, and having an opportunity to work together to find common ground on those issues that divide them.
President Rouhani: I thank you, indeed. I hope we all succeed in our mission. If they help promote our national interest, and help us deliver the pledges we make to our people.
Charlie Rose: Thank you.
Charlie Rose
http://www.charlierose.com/watch/60271951
